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MoogleMB.com :: View topic - Sonic Advance 3 Impressions (spoilers, of course)
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Sonic Advance 3 Impressions (spoilers, of course)
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 6:54 am    Post subject: Sonic Advance 3 Impressions (spoilers, of course) Reply with quote

Well, it finally popped up in IRC -- Darthmoogle gave me a nod when he said Dan Sidney was sending it to him. Impressions:

Quote:
<BlazeHedgehog> eh?
<BlazeHedgehog> 2D Chao Gardens?
<BlazeHedgehog> For the record I would like to say I don't like the idea of having voice in these games
<BlazeHedgehog> Having Sonic shout "YEAH!!!!!!" when you do his L-button-trick (it's L instead of R, now) is really annoying
<BlazeHedgehog> Wow, this is kind of buggy

<BlazeHedgehog> Cripes, whoever designed this level sucked
<M|RO> what, is it like playing XG?
<BlazeHedgehog> No, but the flow is really lame. Lots of stoping and starting
<BlazeHedgehog> And lots of moments where they go "we spring you this way and now you go THIS way!"
<M|RO> as opposed to SA2's not having to do anything but press right
<Kitsune> Have you run across any large gaps into endless pits yet?
<BlazeHedgehog> No pits yet
<BlazeHedgehog> Spikes are in full effect, though
<BlazeHedgehog> they're bloody everywhere

<BlazeHedgehog> I see Omochao is as captain obvious as ever
<BlazeHedgehog> There's one at the start of act 2
<BlazeHedgehog> his message: "HEAD FOR THE GOAL"

<BlazeHedgehog> I wonder if that's because it's a beta or what, or if that's another Chaotix-emulation
<BlazeHedgehog> When you destroy badniks, instead of spawning animals, they spawn a single ring


Boss now. You fight Gemerl much like you did Knuckles in Sonic & Knuckles. He takes about four hits to go down, then Eggman comes and saves him. Boss is weird. If you've seen the screenshots, Eggman is inside the hammer bit, and it slides side to side. Very easy, and very... awkward.

The boss is especially easy when you have Tails. As long as you can avoid Eggman's attacks, Tails automatically attacks Eggman for you.

Eggman's voice sounds like a sound-alike.

There's palette errors when you hit Eggman (?).

There are sub-quests within stages? I don't know. There are Chao sprinkled around levels. 10 per stage, maybe?

Found a spring in the Adventure Field; Omochao tells me I need a Key to unlock it.

New type of spring: Hit a button and the springs activate themselves and allow you to spring on them. Most of them have timers attached.

Sunset Hill's music is a remix of Green Hill Zone.

Invincibility time has been drastically cut short -- might be as short as 10 seconds, maybe even 5, I haven't been paying attention much.

Control is very different from Sonic advance 2 -- acceleration seems slower, the trick button seems only to do Sonic's spinning kick. No insta-shield. Omochao mentioned something about switching abilities or characters or something back in act 1 to overcome an obstacle, but I can't figure out what the hell he ment. (after investigation; trick button(s) seem to work as they did in SAdv2 -- you can use either L or R this time, but strangely, Sonic won't do the trick until AFTER you release the button. So you can press up and hold L as you're in the air, and Sonic won't do the trick until you release L)

Another new type of spring -- it slowly pushes downward. Depending on when you hit the jump button while it's "Charging up", depends on how high it springs you.

Uh, just got a Game Over after I got "Squashed" by a moving platform. Except... I hit it on the side. Defenitely unfinished.

Interesting. Holding R while you're on the ground creates some kind of funky vortex that calls your partner to you -- and then you hold him. Releasing R sends you shooting off at top-speed.

2D Chao Garden tells me there are 7 levels, and 10 Chao in each level (spread across 3 acts). You cannot take care of the Chao or anything, just view the ones you've collected.

There is no save/load screen or anything. If you get a game over, you're thrown back to Route 99. Stage Select is activated via a warp-ring in Route 99 that takes you to a sort of... I don't know, place or something, with warp gates to the other levels. Of course, you can't access levels you haven't gotten to yet.

On the Character Select screen, Tails sounded like he was from Sonic Heroes. In-game he sounds older, almost like a new voice. Another sound-alike?

Bottomless pits show up as early as Sunset Hill, and due to how complex the levels feel, they're a bigger pain in the ass than ever, it feels like. I'm finding them very difficult to avoid and they're eating alot of my lives.

Bungie Jumping in Sunset Hill.

Minigame now, found it in sunset hill. "Push the buttons to get 8 points!" there's colored buttons, each gives a different point value. There's six buttons in all, one lights up and the colors change. You gotta be fast. Winning it nets you an extra life.

Another Minigame, "Defeat all enemies". You can't die. Killing enemies makes them spawn flowers like Sonic CD =P

Aha, holding R is the special ability Omochao spoke of. When you're Tails with Sonic, holding it allows you to blast off at full speed. When you're Sonic with Tails, holding it allows you to do a leap-frog jump that sends Sonic really, really, REALLY high up.

Gemerl at the end of Sunset Hill Act 3. He's like he was in the Route 99 Boss Round, but he's got a new spin move.

Knuckles can't glide, only do a headbutt thrust move. Can't climb, either.

Unlike Chaotix, picking up your buddy doesn't make you invincible -- infact, it makes you more vulerable because you can't spin.

Different team-ups do more than just change the R button special; putting Tails as the Leader and Knuckles as the partner gives Tails a stronger tail-whip move -- instead of just whipping his tail around he spins his whole body like a tornado. Infact, it changed all of Tails moves -- instead of flying, he glides like Knuckles, and jumping and pressing b gives him a quick insta-shield kind of like Sonic used to have.

Knuckles + Tails = Regular Knuckles (climbing, gliding, etc)

Sunset Hill Boss is Eggman in hamster ball of doom.

Zone 3 is Ocean Base, interesting music. No bottomless pits yet, it's thing seems to be crushers -- I've found myself being flattened quite often.

Ocean Base's boss is Spring Eggman -- you have to position yourself between his two big legs and hit him from underneath.

Zone 4 is Toy Kingdom. Again, interesting music.

That's nasty. Piggy Bank enemies -- when you get hit, they steal all your rings.

Ugh, Jack-in-the-boxes. Some contain springs and some contain spikes, and you don't know which until your rings are bouncing about the landscape. (Oh, I get it. When the icon is red, it's spikes, when the icon is blue, it's a spring. And it alternates)

Partner AI is completely retarded. Often times I find myself roaming levels practically solo unless I use the R button to use my partner's special ability. It likes to wander off on it's own too much.

Odd, in Sunset Hill when I fought Gemerl at the end of Act 3 Knuckles shown up and I got to play as him -- fought Gemerl in Toy Kingdom, got nothing?

Eggman in Toy Kingdom is a Jack in the Box. Pretty easy.

Oh, cool. I got Tails to fly Knuckles around -- while charging up my R move I jumped, and I ended up jumping right into Tails -- he started flying and holding Knuckles, and I could control him. (edit: I get it! If you release R on the ground, you do the leapfrog. If you do it in the air, Tails flies you around!)

Zone 5 is Twinkle Snow. (Sonicteam's really running out of names for this stuff)

Twinkle Snow's boss is really stupidly hard. It's auto scrolling -- you just jump from falling platform to falling platform. If the platform falls on Eggman's head, you score a hit. He also shoots a very-hard-to-avoid spike ball at you. I got lots of gameovers on this one.

Zone 6 is Cyber Track, and so far it's really ugly and unoriginal. It takes all the unique features of the previous levels and gives them an ugly techno-tastic makeover. Interesting use of reverse gravity, though.

Cyber Track's boss is a deadly game of pong.

Zone 7, the final Zone, is "Chaos Angel". The music isn't too hot but the stage itself is freakin' awesome. There's two portions to it -- outside and inside. Outside.... makes me think of "Genocide City". There's stormclouds that flash, and way in the distance you can see skyscrapers. Inside, the thing turns into a neo-techno pyramid. Re-uses badniks from Sunset Hill, and a few gimmicks from the other stages, though.

More impressions as I play. Defenitely a different feeling sort of Sonic game so far.
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Last edited by BlazeHedgehog on Sun Mar 21, 2004 10:20 pm, edited 31 times in total
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 6:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adventure Fields?
2D Chao Garden?
10 Chao in a level?

I dunno... but I think I like the direction this game is heading in.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 7:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nah, the chao are spread in all three stages, plus in the "field". Those buggers are everywhere...

Enemy hit detection is horribly off at this stage... you can have a perfect shot, and it will -still- register that it hit you = pain.

I also died several times in the third world (the marine place) due to a spike error... I fly beside it, and pow, you die =D.

Prototypes are neat, anyway. It's at least affirmed I must have this game, albeit hopefully the full Japanese one will have Japanese instead of english voicing.

... I want to unlock Amy. Amy~! Jiimeru.... sucks. Your partner also has the AI of a dead beetle.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

*plays game* This is interesting o_o I think I like. I've only made it to Sunset Hill so far... The adventure field confused me at first. I'm surprised by how much talking is in this...

Oh, and Gemel reminds me of Metarru-Sama in ways that make me seethe.

*goes back to playing*
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BlazeHedgehog wrote:
Sunset Hill's music is a remix of Green Hill Zone.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 4:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Sonic Advance 3 Impressions (spoilers, of course) Reply with quote

BlazeHedgehog wrote:
Sunset Hill's music is a remix of Green Hill Zone.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Question: Is this ROM definately still a beta, or does it seem finished?
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 5:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

*looks at the previous two replies* I missed that gag, I think.

Anyway, time to go ROM hunting... I do admit, while some things sound clever (like characters like Knuckles playing _completely_ differently depending on who's the partner), I'm not sure I like the sound of some other elements. (Ooh, wow, finding Chao. Thank you, got enough of that from Heroes.)
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 5:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The secret to getting the other characters? Use Sonic as your lead character.

I don't like that aspect... if I like having Amy and Tails as a pair, they should unlock the other characters as well!

Does the ice stage remind anyone of Robotnik Winter from one of the GG games?...

Chao are not necessary to find I think... maybe for emeralds or something. Dunno, don't care.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 7:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most design stuff seems finished, Sz, but it's still rough around the edges. There's LOTS of quirky bugs surrounding floating platforms mainly. You can get crushed under stuff very easily by hitting it at a wrong angle. I've heard of a few other bugs, too, but I haven't encountered them.

But yes, still defenitely unfinished.

I'm not sure if I like the game so far either. Sonic Advance 2 was smooth as butter when it came to flow... the level design in this seems to jerk you around all over the place. Rarely do have enough room to accelerate for too long before the game thrusts you off in a different direction. Levels are so complex and jam-packed full of stuff...

And with having to press buttons to make platforms appear and for certain springs to "unlock" gives it a slight puzzle element that I don't think I like having in a Sonic game.

It's very "weird" feeling, is what I'm trying to say. It's... not Sonic. But I don't know what it is. It's a good game, don't get me wrong, but I still think I prefer Sonic Advance 2 (Warts and all) to this.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 7:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I got my hands on it... And I dont like it.

For one, the music is of a very beepy and poor quality, the voices turn out to be annoying.

The level design is messy and is still missing what gave Sonic 3K its "umph", but I can quite put my finger on what exactly Sonic 3K has that this dosent...

The partnering is practically uselss. I have yet to come across a part of the game that actually would make good use of it.

The graphics are repetitive and rather boring to look at. You never quite know where in a level you are, you just hold the right button and press jump ocasionaly.

In short, I hate it. This isnt Sonic The Hedgehog

Rating...
E: 4/10
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice of you to base so much on a beta that's months from being finished.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 8:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gecko, did you even play it? This isnt a Sonic 2 beta-esque beta, its a basically complete beta, it has the games endings and everything. I highly doubt Sega will change all of the level's designs before the final release.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 8:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm up to Toy Kingdom myself (although I had to backtrack and rebeat Sunset Hill 3 with a Sonic & Tails team instead of the opposite to get Knuckles... I probably missed someone in Ocean Palace, as well). The level design... it needs work. The worst part is the first zone, Route 99. The difficulty is ramped INSANELY up for a first zone, with way too many spikes and enemies always placed just where you'd normally land from a ramp or spring. Sunset Hill and Ocean Palace are _easier_ than Zone 99, and that's a problem.

I hate the Adventure stages. There's nothing interesting to them, they just delay you while you're trying to get to the next act.

Most of the Omochao advice is completely worthless. It's just as well, you have to almost totally stop and hold Up to pick it up and listen to what it says.

What they said above about the partner AI. After about the first thirty seconds, unless you "call" them (which takes time), you're not going to see them again for the most part. :P They don't seem to have the ability to "magically" catch up to you, and the AI and levels aren't set up to always let them get to you the right way, so while it's nice they're not always in the way... you kind of forget they're supposed to be with you after a while. :P You just run through the levels like normal. (I don't get where this "20 routes" bullocks fits in, either, most of it is the same old "if you can get to it, you can go that way" of before, it doesn't matter what your team is as long as they have abilities comparable enough to what's needed.)

I will say that it makes a dramatic difference who's teamed with who. It really is shocking how different a Tails teamed with Sonic and a Tails teamed with Knuckles is. They obviously put time into the character combinations... but the levels themselves don't seem to care about this.

I wish you could switch who's in the lead on the fly, though, that'd make the game more interesting. :/ Just Select button toggling or something.

The real shame about the game is that it looks pretty, the music is semi-catchy (although I liked Advance 2's far better, I cannot deny Seaside Hill is a good remix), the character combination system is very interesting how much your abilities are altered, but the levels themselves need a LOT of work, and they don't have a lot of time to be worked on. The game is due out late May, I believe. It's going to take some serious hours for them to polish out many of the layout irritations. I hope they do, though, I don't think the general public will like this game if they leave it as is. It's too hard, and too cheap.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 8:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

*has played more now* I'm to the oil ocean whatever level... This game is surprisingly hard O_o Especially considering I haven't managed to unlock anyone yet... how do you do that? Catch all the chao? I'm done for if so u.u

I was really hoping for a Donkey Kong Country style of gameplay. That always was one of my fav games growing up. Heros disappointed me, and now so has SAD3. Blah u.u

The graphics are okay... Sunset Hill is really pretty. I hate the adventure fields tho. So... boring. Not to mention they confused the heck out of me at first.

I still say Gemel reminds me of Metarru-Sama >_< The heck's his perpose anyway? He drops out of the sky, easily gets his ass kicked, then merges with Eggman's boss machine. Wasted use of a character who'll most likely go the way of Bean and Bark, if you ask me.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 8:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whenever you face Gemerl in an act 3, if you have Sonic in the lead you get a new character to play as.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 10:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And Cream is where?....

Seriously. I can't find her.

I don't think the game's that bad... I enjoy it except for the Adventure Field which.... is just bad...

Pair Sonic and Amy =D it so cute.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 10:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've only gotten Knuckles so far, and I'm up to the middle of Toy Kingdom... did I miss Cream?
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I found Amy in Toy Kingdom and Knux at Sunset Hill..
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 10:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I got the game. It seems that this time Dr. Robotnik is going to try to use the Chaos Emeralds for something evil, and Sonic and his friends must stop him. Way to be original.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 10:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bah.. I'm too lazy to look for the ROM. The game never interested me too much, anyway... I think my sonic fandom is starting to die. :\
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, the Sonic Fandom, which has more fans now than ever before, is dying, while Sonic himself is at the peak of his popularity. Sonic hasn't been this popular in 9 years.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 10:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

He said "my", not "the".
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Er, oh. Right. Sneaky words!
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2004 11:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now give me the ROM so I can hack you in some Knuckles x Knuckles action like Moogle is proudly presenting. ;D
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